Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Civil Service Discussion.

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Rob2old
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by Rob2old »

IMO, the resistance to get vaccinated is more political than anything else. Since federal employees don't have a lot of workspace, I would refuse to work near the unvaccinated.

Divisiveness over pandemic response efforts has continued throughout the country. Low vaccination rates in many places are tied to a climate in which misinformation and partisan politics are often shaping Americans minds more than medical professionals and scientific expertise.

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acidfly
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by acidfly »

Rob2old wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 11:08 pm IMO, the resistance to get vaccinated is more political than anything else. Since federal employees don't have a lot of workspace, I would refuse to work near the unvaccinated.

Divisiveness over pandemic response efforts has continued throughout the country. Low vaccination rates in many places are tied to a climate in which misinformation and partisan politics are often shaping Americans minds more than medical professionals and scientific expertise.
LMAO your bias is showing. BTW are you vaccinated? If so why are you so worried about the unvaxed or what about someone who has had Covid and has nature immunity? Thinking people don't want to get it because of political reasons is very short sighted. Israel has the highest vaccinated numbers of any country but yet they are still at high levels of cases. You don't want to work with someone unvaccinated?? lmao. I've had the measles vax and don't worry about getting the measles or TB or Small pox. But people say "it reduces the impact and deaths" I've yet to see any firm data on that double speak narrative.

PhilJohn
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by PhilJohn »

Rob2old wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 11:10 pm IMO, the resistance to get vaccinated is more political than anything else. Since federal employees don't have a lot of workspace, I would refuse to work near the unvaccinated.

Divisiveness over pandemic response efforts has continued throughout the country. Low vaccination rates in many places are tied to a climate in which misinformation and partisan politics are often shaping Americans minds more than medical professionals and scientific expertise.
Your thinking is a bit flawed.

Why would you argue for me to get the vaccine when science (You mentioned) shows I already have natural immunity which is 9x more effective than any current vaccine offered. And how is ones own medical choices have anything to do with what YOU are comfortable with? You dont have that power over anyone.

My advise, if you are concerned that your vaccine doesnt work, stay home.
Last edited by PhilJohn on Thu Oct 14, 2021 2:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

PhilJohn
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by PhilJohn »

acidfly wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 1:39 am
Rob2old wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 11:08 pm IMO, the resistance to get vaccinated is more political than anything else. Since federal employees don't have a lot of workspace, I would refuse to work near the unvaccinated.

Divisiveness over pandemic response efforts has continued throughout the country. Low vaccination rates in many places are tied to a climate in which misinformation and partisan politics are often shaping Americans minds more than medical professionals and scientific expertise.
LMAO your bias is showing. BTW are you vaccinated? If so why are you so worried about the unvaxed or what about someone who has had Covid and has nature immunity? Thinking people don't want to get it because of political reasons is very short sighted. Israel has the highest vaccinated numbers of any country but yet they are still at high levels of cases. You don't want to work with someone unvaccinated?? lmao. I've had the measles vax and don't worry about getting the measles or TB or Small pox. But people say "it reduces the impact and deaths" I've yet to see any firm data on that double speak narrative.
Exactly! This person wouldnt even work with someone not vaccnated. Eventhough;
1) We assume he/she is vaccinated, but still fears getting covid?
2) Fails to speak on or consider if one has NI
3) Falsly states any person, no matter the situation, is making a political statement who doesnt get vaccinated.

Its always the ones who scream politcs who are the most political.

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evilanne
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by evilanne »

I got a kick out of the opening of this video and several other parts.
https://rumble.com/vnqlp3-10.14.21-we-a ... it-to.html
**Trigger Alert for Ultra Liberals...don't watch**
There is some other political stuff but has quite a bit on the vaccines sprinkled throughout

Rob2old watch the 3 minutes starting at 42:40 regarding the numbers. Bad news if you are vaccinated, you can still get COVID and the vaccines don't stop the Delta Variant. The good news is you have 99% chance of surviving and there are effective early treatments available.

(Note: if you are still working and resisting the vax don't quit, if the Feds ever get around to firing anyone, just make sure to find a good lawyer)

tspme
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by tspme »

Vaccines aren't 100% effective. We know that. Throwing that known fact out is pointless. If it reduced my chance of dying by 1% I'd be in and it's closer to 80% or more.

How many people died from the COVID-19 vaccine? How many died from COVID-19? It's not a complicated decision. But don't look here for advice. Talk to your doctor. Listen to them, not me.

There's no government overreach that I can see. An employer is requiring that all of it's employees are vaccinated. They are paying for the time to get the vaccine. If there are side effects that time is covered too. If an employee chooses not to comply, recognize please that it is a choice, they are likely to be removed from service.

Medical and Religious accomodations are being considered. Bear in mind 99.9% (made up) of people have received vaccines in the past. States require them for public schools. Most people get them for whatever reason. So if you want to say it violates your religion I hope you aren't doing that after recieving other vaccines.

Because the federal government is the employer some confuse that with government overreach. If we lean into this a little all direction coming from your supervisor are government overreach. The federal government is pretty reasonable.

Your religion means you have to have facial hair but your agency has standards. It get worked out. Your job requires work on Sunday but your religion requires a day of rest. The federal government tries to work it out but ultimately if you work for the DEA you can't expect the bad guys to sit out. The job has to get done. This is no different.

You have choices and no one is being physically forced to take a vaccine. If you feel strongly find another job.

So much drama. It's a simple choice but some folks want to get paid and not follow orders.

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acidfly
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by acidfly »

tspme wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 3:20 pm Vaccines aren't 100% effective. We know that. Throwing that known fact out is pointless. If it reduced my chance of dying by 1% I'd be in and it's closer to 80% or more.

How many people died from the COVID-19 vaccine? How many died from COVID-19? It's not a complicated decision. But don't look here for advice. Talk to your doctor. Listen to them, not me.

There's no government overreach that I can see. An employer is requiring that all of it's employees are vaccinated. They are paying for the time to get the vaccine. If there are side effects that time is covered too. If an employee chooses not to comply, recognize please that it is a choice, they are likely to be removed from service.

Medical and Religious accomodations are being considered. Bear in mind 99.9% (made up) of people have received vaccines in the past. States require them for public schools. Most people get them for whatever reason. So if you want to say it violates your religion I hope you aren't doing that after recieving other vaccines.

Because the federal government is the employer some confuse that with government overreach. If we lean into this a little all direction coming from your supervisor are government overreach. The federal government is pretty reasonable.

Your religion means you have to have facial hair but your agency has standards. It get worked out. Your job requires work on Sunday but your religion requires a day of rest. The federal government tries to work it out but ultimately if you work for the DEA you can't expect the bad guys to sit out. The job has to get done. This is no different.

You have choices and no one is being physically forced to take a vaccine. If you feel strongly find another job.

So much drama. It's a simple choice but some folks want to get paid and not follow orders.
"But it was alright, everything was alright, the struggle was finished. He had won the victory over himself. He loved Big Brother.”

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evilanne
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by evilanne »

tspme wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 3:20 pm Vaccines aren't 100% effective. We know that. Throwing that known fact out is pointless. If it reduced my chance of dying by 1% I'd be in and it's closer to 80% or more.
So what if it increases your chance of dying by 1%, or 5-10% within 5 years, are you still going to give your informed consent?

Since the odds of you dying or some other adverse event are greater from these experimental vaccines than COVID, I'm not sure why anyone who actually does any independent research would volunteer. They have pulled other vaccine with less than 50 deaths. We are over 50K deaths from these and they are still claiming them safe & effected :roll: . Unfortunately we do not know what the long term effects will be.

The mandate is a violation of the Nuremberg Code
The voluntary consent of the human subject is absolutely essential. This means that the person involved should have legal capacity to give consent; should be so situated as to be able to exercise free power of choice, without the intervention of any element of force, fraud, deceit, duress, overreaching, or other ulterior form of constraint or coercion; and should have sufficient knowledge and comprehension of the elements of the subject matter involved as to enable him to make an understanding and enlightened decision.
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuremberg_Code

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robika
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by robika »

tspme wrote: Sun Oct 17, 2021 3:20 pm Vaccines aren't 100% effective. We know that. Throwing that known fact out is pointless. If it reduced my chance of dying by 1% I'd be in and it's closer to 80% or more.

How many people died from the COVID-19 vaccine? How many died from COVID-19? It's not a complicated decision. But don't look here for advice. Talk to your doctor. Listen to them, not me.

There's no government overreach that I can see. An employer is requiring that all of it's employees are vaccinated. They are paying for the time to get the vaccine. If there are side effects that time is covered too. If an employee chooses not to comply, recognize please that it is a choice, they are likely to be removed from service.

Medical and Religious accomodations are being considered. Bear in mind 99.9% (made up) of people have received vaccines in the past. States require them for public schools. Most people get them for whatever reason. So if you want to say it violates your religion I hope you aren't doing that after recieving other vaccines.

Because the federal government is the employer some confuse that with government overreach. If we lean into this a little all direction coming from your supervisor are government overreach. The federal government is pretty reasonable.

Your religion means you have to have facial hair but your agency has standards. It get worked out. Your job requires work on Sunday but your religion requires a day of rest. The federal government tries to work it out but ultimately if you work for the DEA you can't expect the bad guys to sit out. The job has to get done. This is no different.

You have choices and no one is being physically forced to take a vaccine. If you feel strongly find another job.

So much drama. It's a simple choice but some folks want to get paid and not follow orders.
So someone who has invested 10-15 years of their life and worked their way up is just simply supposed to walk away from all of it? They are just supposed to throw away everything they have worked for? How about if your fellow worker hasn't gotten the vaccine YOU go get another job? Why do you feel that any employer has the right to tell you what you can/cannot do or put in your body?

If we give into this, what's to stop our employers from saying 'eating red meat has been proven to cause cancer, therefore no one on payroll can eat red meat'? Are you good with that?

Or how about, 'coffee contains acrylamide which has been linked to cancer, therefore no one on payroll may ever drink coffee ever again or they will be terminated'? Are you willing to leave your career over that?

Or think of any/all other vice(s) you partake in. If your employer were to make you choose between it and your career, would you be good with giving it all up?

Same concept, they are telling us what we can/cannot do with our own body.

I think it's comical that you consider this a "simple choice." People are being forced, yes forced, to decide between giving up their career or giving up their right to decide what happens to their own body. How many of the Amendments in the Bill of Rights do you think are "simple choices"?
2019: Ignore everything that Mr. Imperfect says. Just roll the dice, will probably do better.
2020: Did Mr. Imperfect hack my fantasy account?
2021: My fantasy account got COVID.


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bloobs
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by bloobs »

Image
Anger and intolerance are the enemies of correct understanding.
― Mahatma Gandhi

If it's a choice between a difficult truth and a simple lie, people will take the lie every time. Even if it kills them.
― Paul Murray

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Aitrus
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by Aitrus »

bloobs wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:03 am Image
Complex issues can't be fully discussed or nuanced in 140 characters, so it doesn't make the one engaging in such a lengthy discussion a narcissist. Not that a narcissist can't engage in word salad (just look at our politicians), but saying that anyone who engages in word salad is a de-facto narcissist isn't quite logical. There are many non-narcissistic people who are nonetheless long-winded.
Seasonal Musings 2021: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=18757
Recommended Reading: http://tspcenter.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=13474
"It's not what happens to you, but how you react to it that matters" Epictetus

rockhard
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by rockhard »

My wife and I would always love playing "Name That Fallacy" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_f ... _fallacies) and (https://owl.purdue.edu/owl/general_writ ... acies.html)
with our children while watching the different news channels.
This is so much more fruitful. :lol:

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bloobs
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by bloobs »

Aitrus wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:31 am
bloobs wrote: Mon Oct 18, 2021 11:03 am Image
Complex issues can't be fully discussed or nuanced in 140 characters, so it doesn't make the one engaging in such a lengthy discussion a narcissist. Not that a narcissist can't engage in word salad (just look at our politicians), but saying that anyone who engages in word salad is a de-facto narcissist isn't quite logical. There are many non-narcissistic people who are nonetheless long-winded.
Pretty sure the graphic (drawn from an "abusive relationships" web site that i came across this weekend) did not mean to generalize that everyone who dishes out word salads is a narc (although some likely are.) But you're right, I think that image may have been better conveyed through a Venn diagram like graphic that shows word salad aficionados can be a diverse bunch of personalities :P

On a lighter note below is my favorite Venn diagram:

Image

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Aitrus
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Re: Executive Order on Requiring Coronavirus Disease 2019 Vaccination for Federal Employees

Post by Aitrus »

You're right - that Venn is hilarious!
Seasonal Musings 2021: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=18757
Recommended Reading: http://tspcenter.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=13474
"It's not what happens to you, but how you react to it that matters" Epictetus

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